[cma-l] FW: The Cost Of The DAB Trials

Thu Mar 12 16:38:57 GMT 2015

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From: Canalside's The Thread [mailto:office at thethread.org.uk] 
Sent: 12 March 2015 14:02
To: 'Geoff Rogers'
Subject: RE: [cma-l] The Cost Of The DAB Trials

What I don’t understand and can’t get my head around with all this PPL
malarkey is whether someone is listening via FM, Internet or DAB there is
still only one of them    ie:- one person. I have never ever listened at the
same time to a Radio Broadcast with all three in residence. In fact, there
would be a milli-second delay between DAB and FM   I think ??   and in our
case 30 seconds out of sync on the Internet stream 

.so, unless someone
can tell me otherwise, the person listening is still one person listening to
one show via one mode. So why the extra charges anyway ????    sorry chaps,
I don’t get that one ?

I repeat again 

it’s a half legalised money making racket 

nothing more and nothing less

I still have an issue with them   re:- reporting (contra deals)       we
have a contra with the local Milkman, the local Newsagent and the local
Printer 
 my job is very intense and I am extremely busy, I do not put
ticking off how many milk bottles we have a day as a priority so that we can
work out a contra cost. It’s a nonsense, as is all the reporting.

I have said this before and I will say it again, they do not understand what
NET means         I’m not interested in dividing the square roooooot of 24
by 85% and then taking away the number you first thought of because our end
result every year is ZERO      we are not for profit and all monies go back
in the project. Likewise, when we were £9000 in the red four years ago, I
don’t recall them offering a rebate.

I’m not interested in them at all and I believe if it did go to the top we
may have a good case if put together correctly.

To be honest I am so confused with our Internet and FM and then Phase One
another DAB = £500 on top plus reporting would possibly tip me over and I’d
go doolally

I have been trying to file our figures for the past two weeks 

the first
quarter is on, but quarters 2,3 and 4 won’t let me as they keep saying
already reported, which I don’’t think they have 
.it’s all a waste of time
and effort and just causes angst. I can only speak for myself of course
oh   and plenty of others who tell me so, but don’t make their feelings
known.

Nick

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From: cma-l-bounces at mailman.commedia.org.uk
[mailto:cma-l-bounces at mailman.commedia.org.uk] On Behalf Of Geoff Rogers
Sent: 11 March 2015 18:50
To: CMA-L
Subject: Re: [cma-l] The Cost Of The DAB Trials

All the costs seem reasonable apart from the greed shown by PPL insisting on
a separate fee for simulcasting on DAB.  It's unbelievable and I cannot see
any justification for it, can they prove any loss to revenue by being aired
on a trial DAB service?? I give huge credit to PRS for being realistic and
encouraging these trials by waiving any extra fee as they no doubt see that
there is absolutely no justification for it.  

I think we should shout 'unfair' loudly and refuse to take part in the trial
if we are to be subjected to this blatantly unfair and extra burden on what
after all is supposed to be a trial for everyone's benefit.

We should take a stand !

I'll stop ranting now.

Kind regards to all

Geoff

On 11 March 2015 at 17:46, Two Lochs Radio <tlr at gairloch.co.uk> wrote:

That looks about right as far as it goes Andy, but then...

David Duffy of the Radio People says in his localDAB website on the topic
that to increase the chances of succeeding most stations would benefit from
a professionally-written application, which he suggested would cost £900
upwards, or a self-written one can be 'polished up' professionally for £250.
He also estimated installation costs at £350 upwards, typically £500. So,
for stations that don't have the resources to write a comprehensive
application or do the installation engineering that brings us to the region
of:

Existing FM Community Station £1450-£2250 (or more depending on installation
costs)

Existing Online Only Station £2300-£3100 (or more depending on installation
costs) 

There are other potential costs. 

For example if your mast is sited in a designated Area of Outstanding
Natural Beauty or National Scenic Area (as ours are), then you need planning
permission for additional aerials (in theory even for a small change on an
existing mast), which is a another few hundred pounds. On some sites there
is a substantial (sometimes hundreds of pounds) access or rigging
supervision charge from the site owner, or a requirement to use their
nominated riggers. The station is also responsible for installation sundries
such as any extra brackets and mounting hardware.

There are also running costs, plus probably at the very least 100
staff/volunteer work hours.  The good news is the standard setup will
consume only 150W or so power, so only around £100 in electricity.

Ofcom also says it aims ideally to have four Type 1 trials and three each of
type 2 and 3. However, it will only pay for all the equipment for Type 1
trials, pluse two Type 2 trials and one Type 3 trials, which implies that a
Type 2 triallist and two Type 3 triallists might be invited to pay for their
own equipment. In the absence of any willing to do so, I guess they will
have fewer than 10 trials, or they will simply have more Type 1 trials than
they would ideally like.

Of course, at the end of the day, even an all-in cost over 9 months of, say,
£4,000  is a probably fraction of what most existing multiplex operations
would charge you for 9 months carriage, and presumably for some there is the
possibility of the trial multiplex operator charging a fee to partner
content providers for their carriage on the trial multiplex. (wonder if this
would count as broadcast revenue in terms of CR licence conditions?!)

However, after 9 months you have no transmission equipment and no continuing
licence - it is all 'sunk costs' with little residual value. But hopefully
you have some good experience of its impact on listening habits locally, and
it could be a great opportunity in some ways.  I guess it's best looked at
as a glorified RSL. Let's hope that in reality Ofcom decides to offer new
long term licences for the successful trial areas and disposes of the
equipment to them for a nominal value only.

I suppose another option is to sit back and let others carry the cost of
being triallists, and just wait for the long-term small-scale opportunities
to become available!

Alex

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Bay <mailto:radio at bayfm.co.uk>  Fm Radio 

To: cma-l at mailman.commedia.org.uk 

Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2015 3:58 PM

Subject: [cma-l] The Cost Of The DAB Trials

Hi everyone.

We’ve done some homework regarding the cost of the DAB trials - If I’m
stating the obvious/cross posting I apologise.  However, I thought you might
appreciate my sharing this with you.

Ofcom are providing the equipment but:

You would have to pay for someone to install it etc

You would have to pay for transmission site & other costs, eg. Electric

Plus then there are the licence Fees

You'd need to apply for a DSPS Licence Cost £250

Ofcom have waived the Annual Fee so that saves £100

PPL Licence Fee is £500 + vat flat fee for the 9 months = £600

PRS Licence Fee is £0 if you are a licence FM Station
 as long as you don’t
generate more then£29,499 in Net Broadcasting Revenue during the 9 month
trial.

However, If you are an online only station you must be already licenced by
them for the online service and then they will charge you £705.25 + vat =
£846.30
 as long as you don’t generate more then£29,499 in Net Broadcasting
Revenue during the 9 month trial.

So the trial will cost you 

Andy.

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-- 

Geoff Rogers
Programme Director
Susy Radio, Local Community Radio for Redhill and Reigate
On-air across Sussex and Surrey on 103.4FM NOW
Web: susyradio.com <http://www.susyradio.com>

Susy Radio Ltd. A company registered in England and Wales.
Registered Office: 54 Nutfield Road, Merstham, Redhill, Surrey, RH1 3EP.
Registered Number: 06748586

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