[cma-l] is there anybody in there?

Fri May 27 01:02:27 BST 2011

I dont think it directly came about because of the phone line scandal (to be
honest it had been going on for years, it wasnt until the BBC got caught
that it really hit the headlines)

If there is anything in your programme that might suggest to your listeners
that your show is live and it isnt, then you are misleading your listeners,
if its meant to or not is a different issue entirely and not what this rule
is about. (although I suspect if there was evidence that it was
a deliberate ploy to mislead for what ever reason I imagine ofcom really
wouldnt be happy).

Its good that your presenters are not inviting listeners to call during a
pre-recorded (although they still could as long as they say its
pre-recorded, and what they will do with the calls.. assuming they will get
answered or recorded) BUT if they are playing a jingle saying "send us xyz
and said email blah blah" and its pre-recorded then yes that could be
considered a break as its a direct call to action.. If its a jingle
promoting the email for any other reason I dont see why that would cause a
problem.. If your presenters are pre-recording they just need to be given
guidance or not having calls to action and what would constitute..

Ofcom after several of these types of incidents released a statement about
the issue here (Page 17)
http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/enforcement/broadcast-bulletins/obb127/issue127.pdf

Clearly states Ofcoms position on the matter and how they will treat it..
Worth a quick read..

In this case its a simple black and white matter, there was a pre-recorded
call to action for which the listener couldnt interact with the programme
live.. Regardless of if this was intentional or not (In this case it appears
it was just a mistake) it was a breach of the code and Ofcom called it what
it was. They have to be fair to all.. However I strongly doubt that the
station will receive any fines or penalties as long as they dont do it
again.. Like so often with community stations, they get a slap on the wrist
and then told what they did wrong and why. Ofcom wants to work with
Community Stations to make sure they are doing their best to meet the code,
KC etc.

Martin

On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 1:59 PM, Phoenix Dark-Knight <
phoenix.dark-knight at ne1fm.net> wrote:

> Hi all, I have to say the station being in breach over this doesn't sit
> right with me either, the way (I imagine) most read the rule is directly
> associated with the phone-line scandals of years past that mean "don't let
> people phone up for a competition/equivalent if the show is repeated" not
> these very wide interpretations of "misleading listeners".
>
> Here at NE1fm we only repeat one show, that mentions it's repeat once or
> twice when giving out information and doesn't invite calls or emails.
> However, we also have a number of pre-recorded shows, that are presented as
> live, and during those times, I know no-one will be in the studios to take
> calls - now the presenter is not likely to slip a phone number in there if
> s/he's pre-recording, but what if s/he puts a jingle in with our studio
> email on? are we in breach?
>
> Also with our open slot programming, we certainly will have presenters,
> newbies and old hats, who will read out the phone number, txt number and
> email/website addresses all to add to their content/links, and who might
> forget or just not bother to check the 2nd computer screen.
> I think it's very draconian indeed to suggest we're in breach for this last
> point, and whilst I appreciate Ofcom's need to protect the listeners from
> programming that *may* cost people a wasted phonecall or txt (n.b. All our
> call/txt rates are standard) I can't get behind the logic of this decision.
>
> Phoenix D-K
>
> CBIT/NE1fm 102.5
> Virginia House
> Georges Road
> NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE
> NE4 7NQ
>
> [T] 0191 240 1025
> [E] phoenix.dark-knight at ne1fm.net
> [W] http://www.ne1fm.net
> NE1fm 102.5 is owned and operated by CBIT.
> CBIT is registered in England & Wales, Company No. 05022142
>
>
>
> On 26 May 2011 13:34, <cma-l-request at mailman.commedia.org.uk> wrote:
>
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>>   1. Re:  is there anybody in there? (Office - ccr-fm)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 11:36:50 +0100
>> From: "Office - ccr-fm" <office at ccr-fm.co.uk>
>> Subject: Re: [cma-l] is there anybody in there?
>> To: <martin at martinsteers.co..uk <martin at martinsteers.co.uk>>, "'CMA-L'" <
>> cma-l at commedia.org.uk>,
>>        "'jaqui devereux'" <jaqui.devereux at commedia.org.uk>
>> Message-ID:
>>
>>  <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAFLfoHySwD9Hi/viVsoHZf/CgAAAEAAAADr/XrlRix5PruKb9Lm8J/wBAAAAAA==@
>> ccr-fm.co.uk>
>>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>> Martin n? all
>>
>>
>>
>> I forgot to mention in my rant)       we (CCR) plug all week long that
>> some
>> of our programmes are repeated ?.. ie:- 60?s / 70?s / 80?s etc     by
>> doing
>> so PROVES that we are not wishing to deliberately deceive our listeners.
>>
>>
>>
>> I was on-air last week and mentioned that ??the next programme is a repeat
>> of Sundays seventies show??  (as I do everyweek)           whilst the show
>> was playing, three people rang up in the first 20 minutes of the show, all
>> of them said ??oh nevermind I?ll ring back on Sunday?? ????..
>>
>>
>>
>> I fully understand the rules and I fully understand that they are there to
>> protect listeners and Joe public ????. It is unfair to encourage listeners
>> to text / ring shows knowing that they will get no reaction / no answer
>> and
>> be charged ????? certainly if it is being charged at premium competition
>> rate.
>>
>>
>>
>> We don?t have any charges at our station, that is not what we are about
>> and
>> we take every opportunity and care to ensure that listeners are not
>> deceived
>> ???..
>>
>>
>>
>> So, my conclusion is this ????.. rule 2.2 needs changing !
>> it either states clearly that repeated shows are NOT permitted full stop,
>> as
>> this argument will always rear up it?s ugly head or it is left alone and
>> everyone gets fined ???? I don?t think there is a community station in the
>> Land that hasn?t dropped a clanger on this one.
>>
>> Volunteers simply do not have the time or the will to then finish there
>> show
>> and go searching and editing out everytime they mention a phone contact.
>>
>>
>>
>> However, having had my rant I do accept completely that rule 2.2 should
>> exist, but not if common sense can?t be applied.
>>
>>
>>
>> The station in breach ?? have they been fined ??               damn shame
>> if
>> they have.
>>
>>
>>
>> Nick
>>
>>
>>
>>  _____
>>
>> From: cma-l-bounces at mailman.commedia.org.uk
>> [mailto:cma-l-bounces at mailman.commedia.org.uk] On Behalf Of Martin Steers
>> Sent: 26 May 2011 10:26
>> To: Julian Mellor
>> Cc: CMA-L
>> Subject: Re: [cma-l] is there anybody in there?
>>
>>
>>
>> Although I never like to see a station get breached, I must admit in this
>> case they did break the rules, if you read the previous cases and the
>> statement ofcom made at the time they where trying to clamp down on
>> recorded, non line calls to action, and I dont think I disagree with it.
>>
>>
>>
>> If your doing any listener based show that relies heavily on listener
>> engagement be it song requests, thoughts and feelings or any form of
>> voting
>> etc then this can not be pre-recorded, and if its repeated I think you
>> need
>> to make that clear as often as you can to your listeners.
>>
>> The case that got breached wasnt a repeat, as far as I can tell it was a
>> pre-record..
>>
>>
>>
>> And not to be harsh.. but I am afraid "we don't have the capacity to
>> monitor, enforce and edit everything to the level they seem to be
>> requiring." goes against what the station signed up for when you applied
>> for
>> your license and started broadcasting, as a station you have a
>> responsibility for everything you broadcast and it must all be code
>> compliant.
>>
>>
>>
>> I dont know if I agree with having to use the time and date all the time,
>> do
>> your volunteers have an extra 15 minutes to edit their shows? Would a
>> generic "Your listening to a repeat of XYZ show from the XYZ date, any
>> requests taken wont make it to this show but we will try out best to put
>> them in the next show" and get them to stick it at the start of the show,
>> and at regular points during the show (maybe over the original calls to
>> action). You might want to double check with ofcom, but you might find
>> thats
>> a good step in the right direction and maybe all you need to do. Other
>> things you could do is make it clear on websites etc that its a repeat,
>> but
>> use this as a positive to encourage people to listen to the live shows,
>> maybe also look at either auto replying to any incoming messages
>> explaining
>> that its a repeat and you hope to get their request next time.. Either
>> automated or by hand..
>>
>>
>>
>> The rules and code are there to protect the listeners and broadcasters, it
>> has to be the same rules for everyone regardless of the amount of
>> listeners,
>> demographic or if your charging ?1.50 a txt.
>>
>>
>>
>> Martin
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 9:27 AM, Julian Mellor <julian at 10radio.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Earlier this week I saw Ofcom's ruling about a breach of the broadcasting
>> code by a community station not far from here.
>>
>>
>>
>> Apparently a request show was repeated, a member of the public called in
>> to
>> speak to the presenter, was told that in fact the show was a repeat, and
>> so
>> the said member of the public complained to Ofcom that the station was in
>> breach of rule 2.2 (not to materially mislead).  Instead of find the
>> complaint malicious and trivial, Ofcom found against the station and said
>> that they had breached the trust of their listeners.
>>
>>
>>
>> This raised alarm bells for me as we repeat most of our programmes and
>> most
>> invite listeners to email or text in with comments (and sometimes
>> requests)..
>> However, rarely, if ever, do presenters give a date stamp during their
>> programmes so the repeat could be perceived to be live (although there is
>> absolutely no intent to deceive or mislead and most listeners know our
>> schedule well enough or look at the website to see if its live or not).
>> Equally some presenters, especially newbies, often read out the contact
>> details for want of something to say, but then forget to check the emails
>> (which could be construed as deception).
>>
>>
>>
>> I raised the issue with Ofcom of this seemingly draconian interpretation
>> of
>> rule 2.2 (introduced to stop broadcasters running pseudo competitions on
>> premium lines) and pointed out that, as a community station staffed
>> entirely
>> by volunteers, we don't have the capacity to monitor, enforce and edit
>> everything to the level they seem to be requiring.  I said that it would
>> be
>> likely to drive away presenters and stop us repeating anything.  Surely, I
>> said, Ofcom does not want to constrain community broadcasters in this way.
>>
>>
>>
>> They came back the same day (preferring to call rather than write) and
>> said
>> it is indeed their intention to constrain broadcasters.  The way around
>> it,
>> they said, is for any repeated shows to give a date reference when
>> inviting
>> listeners to make contact.  Furthermore,  presenters must not invite
>> contact
>> if they are likely to forget to check the messages.
>>
>>
>>
>> I sent out an instruction to our presenters and already one has come back
>> saying it will destroy his spontaneity and, given that he can't guarantee
>> that a date reference will always be given, he is withdrawing his repeats
>> (4
>> hours of lost programming per week and many saddened listeners).
>>
>>
>>
>> I instinctively react against people banging on about nanny states, red
>> tape
>> etc, but this seems absolute madness and inspires me to move to Tunbridge
>> Wells from where I shall write to my MP.
>>
>>
>>
>> How does everyone else deal with the issue?
>>
>>
>>
>> (And for the avoidance of doubt this is written live at 9:15am on Thursday
>> 26 May but I may be away from my desk when you reply)
>>
>>
>>
>> Julian
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ..............................................................................
>> ......
>>
>>
>>
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