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</head><body><p>That's interesting. What's the model? Low-cost aircon on a duct is useful for radio premises, but I wasn't aware of Xpelair doing anything on 100mm ducting other than the heat recovery units. They have the Digitemp, but that is strictly 'in room' and need a 155m hole through an external wall.</p><p>Fitting modern split-pack aircon is not hard - you can get it with pre-charged pipes that are sealed until connected, so no specialist refrigeration engineering techniques are needed for initial installation. (Although the EU was said to be drafting proposals to ban this method.)<br></p><p>Depending on room layout, one way to cool the studio with minimal noise is to use the equipment/apparatus room as a 'plenum' - ie air condition it noisily as need be,and then have a secondary low noise fan and 10mm/150mm acoustic ducting to exchange air with the studio. It's surprising though how much noise comes down even a convoluted length of acoustic ducting - the best answer is a proper baffle box inline with the ventilation. All these have their issues with dust/cleaning and smoke circulation in the event of a fire.</p><p>One idea we had, since our studio backs onto a garden, was to bury a long length of ducting in the garden and pass air down it and into the studio for silent low-cost cooling, but some thought needs to be given to possible condensation and mould growth in the pipe during humid weather!</p><p>Alex  <br></p><blockquote type="cite">On 10 July 2017 at 18:29 ROBERT TYLER <bobtyler@btinternet.com> wrote:<br><br><div style="color: #000; background-color: #fff; font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63793">Alex</div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63793"><br></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63793" dir="ltr"><span id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63826">It is interesting that X</span>pelair does a cooling unit based on the standard 100mm system. </div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63793" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63793" dir="ltr">DIY studio aircon for less than £1000 and easy as fitting a bathroom fan.</div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63793" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63793" dir="ltr">BT</div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-qtdSeparateBR" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63794"><br><br></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yahoo_quoted" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63897" style="display: block;"><div style="font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63896"><div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 16px;" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63895"><div dir="ltr" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63894"><hr size="1"><span id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_63893" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: small;"><strong><span style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></strong> "Alex Gray, Two Lochs Radio" <tlr@gairloch.co.uk><br> <strong><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></strong> 'ROBERT TYLER' <bobtyler@btinternet.com>; 'The Community Media Association Discussion List' <cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk> <br> <strong><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></strong> Monday, 10 July 2017, 18:16<br> <strong><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></strong> RE: [cma-l] Studio Air conditioning<br> </span></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-y_msg_container" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64060"><br><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64059"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211WordSection1" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64058"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64057"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64056">We do that with the cloakroom extractor fan. Not sure it’s a good idea to rapidly cycle a compressor though.</span></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64093"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">  </span></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64094"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">Alex</span></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64095"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">  </span></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yqt5658452794" id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yqt88223"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64099"><div style="border: none; border-top: solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding: 3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm;" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64098"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64097"><strong><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">From:</span></strong><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64096"> cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk [mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk] <strong>On Behalf Of </strong>ROBERT TYLER<br clear="none"><strong>Sent:</strong> 10 July 2017 17:39<br clear="none"><strong>To:</strong> The Community Media Association Discussion List <cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk><br clear="none"><strong id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64100">Subject:</strong> Re: [cma-l] Studio Air conditioning</span></div></div></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64101"> </div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64104"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;" id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64103"><span id="ox-624f42b69e-yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_64102">I would be really careful and ensure the installer understands the acoustic and airborne sound aspects. You could end up being lovely and cool but having to shout over the motor noise.</span></div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;">I do remember one station I was involved with. The motor noise was so bad and a bright spark came up with the idea of using the fader open micro switch to operate a relay and to turn the fan motor off!</div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;">BT </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36305"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36311"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12.0pt; background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36549"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36548"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36547"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36546"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="text-align: center; background: white;" align="center"><hr size="1" align="center" width="100%"></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><strong id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36739"><span style="font-size: 10.0pt;">From:</span></strong><span style="font-size: 10.0pt;"> Ron M <<a target="_blank" href="mailto:ronm@bridging-thegap.co.uk">ronm@bridging-thegap.co.uk</a>><br clear="none"><strong>To:</strong> The Community Media Association Discussion List <<a target="_blank" href="mailto:cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk">cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a>> <br clear="none"><strong>Sent:</strong> Monday, 10 July 2017, 17:28<br clear="none"><strong>Subject:</strong> Re: [cma-l] Studio Air conditioning</span></div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36702"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36703"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;">Give your intended supplier the spec of the AC units you currently have. Ideally from the operating manual, otherwise tell him the make and send a picture of the unit(s)..</div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36704"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36705"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;">Regards</div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36706"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1499632914501_36707"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;">Ron Millet</div><div><blockquote><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yqt16587"><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;">On 10 Jul 2017, at 16:28, Martyn Haynes <<a target="_blank" href="mailto:martyn.haynes@wcrfm.com">martyn.haynes@wcrfm.com</a>> wrote:</div></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div><div><div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">Hi All,</span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">I</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt; color: black;">’</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">ve got an initial funding meeting on Wednesday and I</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt; color: black;">’</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">ve been trying to get a ball park figure for replacing the Air-conditioning units in our studios as they</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt; color: black;">’</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">re well past their best and need renewing asap.<span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">I</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt; color: black;">’</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">ve put in a couple of quote requests to some local air-con suppliers but they won</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt; color: black;">’</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">t even give me an idea without coming to take a look (understandable I guess)  but they</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt; color: black;">’</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">re not able to visit site until after our meeting. <span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">I was wondering if anyone had air con installed in the last couple of years and could give me an idea of cost.  I know it</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt; color: black;">’</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">s not going to be accurate and every building is different, but I just need an idea at this point.<span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">Any advice would be gratefully received.<span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">Thanks</span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">Martyn</span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">--</span></span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">Martyn Haynes</span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">Director</span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;">101.8 WCR FM</span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"><a target="_blank" href="http://www.wcrfm.com/"><span style="color: #954f72;">www.wcrfm.com</span></a></span></span><br></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div><div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span style="font-size: 11.0pt;"> </span></div></div></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211"><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;">_______________________________________________</span></span><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211">Reply -</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a target="_blank" href="mailto:cma-l@commedia.org.uk"><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;">cma-l@commedia.org.uk</span></a><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211">The cma-l mailing list is a members' service provided by the Community Media Association -</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a target="_blank" href="http://www.commedia.org.uk/"><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;">http://www.commedia.org.uk</span></a><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;"><br clear="none"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211">Twitter:</span><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a target="_blank" href="http://twitter.com/community_media"><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;">http://twitter.com/community_media</span></a><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;"><br clear="none"></span><a 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11.5pt;">http://www.commedia.org.uk/about/cma-email-lists/email-list-guidelines/</span></a><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;"><br clear="none"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211">_______________________________________________</span><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><span class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211">To unsubscribe or manage your CMA-L mailing list subscription please visit:</span><br clear="none"></span><a target="_blank" href="http://mailman.commedia.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/cma-l"><span style="font-size: 11.5pt;">http://mailman.commedia.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/cma-l</span></a><br></div></div></div></blockquote></div><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;"> </div></div></div></div><div id="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211yqt95459"><div class="ox-624f42b69e-yiv0454455211MsoNormal" style="background: white;">_______________________________________________<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Reply - <a target="_blank" 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