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<p>Bob - what you have written from 30 years' experience is very valuable - thank you.<br>
But - forgive me - it all reads as probability - and what we must have here is cast-iron legal facts.<br>
So many times we are told that the Royalty Societies are all-powerful with formidable litigation support.</p>
<p>Sorry - that doesn't frighten me one bit.<br>
These situations are all governed by UK Law and administered by one of the best Judiciaries on the planet.<br>
I will not be bullied by any overbearing organisation - of any variety - and neither should the rest of us.</p>
<p>We've recently been shown the power that an MP can exert by summoning a Government Agency to answer questions at The House.</p>
<p>Let's use it!</p>
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<p class="ecxMsoNormal" style="line-height:22.72px"><font face="Calibri" size="3"><span style="line-height:22.72px"><span style="line-height:22.72px; color:rgb(34,34,34)">Ian Hickling</span></span><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34); line-height:17.9867px; line-height:17.9867px"></span></font></p>
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<font size="2"><i style="line-height:22.72px"><span style="line-height:22.72px; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(34,34,34)">Office: 016 3557 8435 (07h to 22h GTS)</span></i><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(34,34,34); line-height:17.9867px"></span></font></p>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk <cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk> on behalf of Bob Tyler <bobtyler@btinternet.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 10 December 2016 22:02<br>
<b>To:</b> cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [cma-l] PPL & PRS for Music Joint Licence for Community Radio</font>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The deal offered by the joint licencing bodies is a very good deal and commercial radio would bite their arm off to get a similar arrangement.
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I have only two concerns. </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The ‘Top Line’ details I saw posted recently are what they say they are, top line/main points. It is not the actual contract. I do not know if a proposed contract has been disclosed for further approval?</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I am not a current licence holder, so I would assume that as with most of PPL/PRS contracts they are confidential. Therefore any broadcaster wishing to sign should seek to have the agreement checked and explained by a solicitor before signing.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thereby lies another tale. The agreement is probably offered to all and therefore PPL/PRS cannot alter the agreement to favour a particular licensee. So if two or three sign, it’s done deal, everyone gets the same.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In other words, the devil is in the detail and I am surprised that they are suggesting this agreement commences next month (less than 3 weeks away).</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I would not sign anything until it was generally felt that all concerned were happy with the contract.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Whatever you might think. These two bodies are law abiding, they are very savvy legally but also accommodating. As far as I understand,
<u class="">they</u> set this commencement date and it is not unreasonable to request a period of time to review the legalities of what you are signing. If you were to delay the contract commencing next month, it would simply be backdated.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">My second concern is that having dealt with these collecting bodies for more than 30 years I am familiar with the way they conduct their business. I believe they will ensure they collect their fees due to them under the signed agreement.
The sums of money are smaller than any of their other licences but this is certainly a very favourable proposal. However, when you sign the agreement you will be expected to keep up to date with the payments.
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Personally I feel this unique deal should have been a CMA Exclusive.
<u class="">In other words, only available to CMA members</u>. I don’t think it is too late to achieve this.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">It is all a bit irrelevant in the context of the current Ofcom Consultation.</p>
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On 2 Dec 2016, at 15:44, Ian Hickling <<a href="mailto:transplanfm@hotmail.com" class="">transplanfm@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
So Martin - the message appears to be that you have to be very rich to get justice from such organisations.<br class="">
Contrast this with what we've been able to achieve with Ofcom - an Agency of H M Government - by careful research and reasoned argument - without having to resort to pa<span class="" style="font-size:12pt">ying any fees to anyone.<br class="">
Is there a lesson to be learned there I wonder?</span></div>
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<font size="2" class=""><i class="" style="line-height:22.72px"><span class="" style="line-height:22.72px; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(34,34,34)">Car: 075 3098 0115 (only responds when driving)</span></i><span class="" style="line-height:17.9867px; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(34,34,34)"></span></font></div>
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<i class="" style="line-height:22.72px"><span class="" style="line-height:22.72px; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font size="2" class="">6 Horn Street, Compton, NEWBURY, RG20 6QS</font></span></i></div>
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<font face="Calibri, sans-serif" class="" style="font-size:11pt"><b class="">From:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" class="">cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" class="">cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a>>
on behalf of Martin Steers <<a href="mailto:martin@martinsteers.co.uk" class="">martin@martinsteers.co.uk</a>><br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>02 December 2016 14:55:42<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Canalside's The Thread; The Community Media Association Discussion List<br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [cma-l] PPL & PRS for Music Joint Licence for Community Radio</font>
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<div dir="ltr" class="">Dear all,
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">The CMA has continued to represent the sector and lobby hard for better terms etc from PPL & PRS, we have won some concessions with the reduced fees for CR stations who want to simulcast DAB & CR FM/AM. (I think from memory a saving of £500 a
year).. and there are also other areas and work that still needs to be done as far as I am concerned (RSL fees, SSDAB for CR/Not for Profits etc).</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">However other than representation and lobbying as the CMA currently are doing, I am not sure what else the organisation can do that is responsible and legal.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">The CMA couldnt condone or recommend a boycott of fees or anything else that could get stations or the CMA into legal hot water, nor can they engage legal advice without a "warchest".</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">If the sector wants to come together and put up some money to consider taking PPL/PRS to copyright tribunal then I am sure the CMA could help coordinate the effort and bring it all together, but I suspect we would need at least £10k just to engage
a firm to do some ground work.. and the sector could be looking at tens if not hundreds of thousands of pounds to fully take the case. Not to mention I think the looser pays all the costs dont they? so that would need to be budgeted for.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">As ever I would recommend stations consider the situation, evaluate your numbers / finances, what counts on NBR etc I suspect 95% of stations would only pay the minimal fees and if you need someone else to check your numbers I am sure the office
or myself would be more than happy.</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
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<div class="">Martin</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
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<div class="gmail_extra"><br class="">
<div class="gmail_quote">On 2 December 2016 at 14:36, Canalside's The Thread<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:office@thethread.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">office@thethread.org.uk</a>></span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:<br class="">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width:1px; border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204); border-left-style:solid; padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-GB" class="">
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Good Heavens<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u> <u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">I can have field day on this discussion ………I’m just a bit busy at the moment but I’ll sink my teeth into it when I get five mins.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u> <u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Nick Dumpty<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u> <u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><b class=""><span lang="EN-US" class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l-bounces@mailman.<wbr class="">commedia.org.uk</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[mailto:<a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l-bounces@mailman.<wbr class="">commedia.org.uk</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On
Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b><a href="mailto:tlr@gairloch.co.uk" target="_blank" class="">tlr@gairloch.co.uk</a><br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>02 December 2016 12:20</span></div>
<div class="">
<div class="h5"><br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>The Community Media Association Discussion List <<a href="mailto:cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a><wbr class="">><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [cma-l] PPL & PRS for Music Joint Licence for Community Radio<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></div>
</div>
<p class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"></p>
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<div class="h5">
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><u class=""></u> <u class=""></u></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">That's a nice thought, but a very simplistic approach Pippa.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">Your advice is probably good for a station that is allowed to take advertising and has a population of, say, 10,000 or more to go at. But it's not so easy for a station serving a huge area with a population
of under 3,000. I have no problem with payment of reasonable royalties, but the payment should be better related to the value of the rights being granted.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">Under the present system, a small station that can't feasibly generate more than, say, £10,000 in broadcast revenue pays more than 15% of its revenue in PPL/PRS royalties (thanks to the effect of minimum
fees), whereas a station in a more populated area that is able to raise, say, £50,000 a year, and has a much larger pool of potential volunteers available, pays around 3%.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">There are other unjustified anomalies - such as if you add an FM relay that doubles your potential audience, there is no direct additional charge, but if you add a DAB transmitter serving fewer people
than your existing FM transmitter you do pay extra.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px">Alex<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></div>
<blockquote class="" style="margin-top:5pt; margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:12pt">On 02 December 2016 at 11:47 Pippa at Curly Radio <<a href="mailto:pippa@curlyradio.com" target="_blank" class="">pippa@curlyradio.com</a>> wrote:<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></p>
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Alternatively we can all stop wasting valuable time and energy in fighting the system. Instead, focus on developing brilliant locally focused programmes
which engage and build your audience. That way you will have advertisers and sponsors lined up who will cover the cost of your licences.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
</div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="">
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">It’s also much more fun<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span id="cid:image001.png@01D24CA9.8258D710"><image001.png></span><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Happy Friday everyone.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Pippa<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; background-color:rgb(245,245,245)">
<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">From:</span></strong><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Canalside's The Thread<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Sent:</span></strong><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday, December 2, 2016 11:21 AM<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">To:</span></strong><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>'The Community Media Association Discussion
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<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">Subject:</span></strong><span class="" style="font-size:10pt; font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [cma-l] PPL & PRS for Music Joint
Licence for Community Radio<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Dear All</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">I suggested to PRS/PPL back in 2011 that would it not make sense for all concerned to have :-</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">1)</span><span class="" style="font-size:7pt"> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">One
collection point</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">2)</span><span class="" style="font-size:7pt"> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">One
fee covering everything</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">3)</span><span class="" style="font-size:7pt"> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">One
fee (be it either a minimum fee or an average fee)</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Like quite a lot of my suggestions over the years, they were dismissed and laughed at. Very odd though that 2 / 3 / 4 / 5 years later
down the line we always end regurgitating them and tagging them with ‘’ah, that’s not a bad idea’’ or actually implementing them full stop. Remember that most do actually agree but fall under the category of the ‘silent majority’</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">If you would like me to give you a list of those observations, pointers etc I can do ---- I’m up to 15 at the moment on my list,
which is exactly the same number as my ‘’well I told you so’s’’</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Best if we get to the nitty gritty though</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">We have to face up to the fact that in all changes of things and tweaks to things some folk will be slightly better off and some will
be slightly worse off (that’s life) ……………. But alas ----- unless we start working as a team and a fraternity we will forever be going around in circles and being picked off one by one and walked on by the authorities.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">I hope at the AGM this year we actually walk out of the place at 5:30pm with a clear vision as to what works, what doesn’t work,
what we have concerns about, and most importantly what are we going to do about it, as whinging for the next 14 Years (me included) is not acceptable. I would also hope that we stop being nicey nicey all the time and face up to the fact that sometimes sadly
we have to be controversial and we have to say the things that are maybe not pleasant.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">I’m afraid with this PRS/PPL malarkey it does drop on my ‘’well I told you so list’’ unless I have missed something, we haven’t
really gained anything ??? or that’s how it seems.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">I hear what Bill is saying and there are some changes to the DAB malarkey however, the truth is, the majority of us couldn’t even
afford a Yogurt Carton and a piece of string, let alone DAB …… so it’s a none starter.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">NBR or whatever you call it in relation to Community Radio HAS TO GO BON VOYAGE / DUMP IT ! it rubs against everything we stand
for, I have been saying this since day dot. We (Canalside) do not fill this form in as I refuse to do so. I suggest everyone else (all 270) do exactly the same. It isn’t NET it is GROSS …………. And Gross has no bearing on what we do.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">We (Community Radio) are charitable, With some actually fully fledged charities, all not-for-profit and the rules that we operate under
(or is that Straight-Jacket?) means we do exactly what it says on the Can/Tin.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">With this in mind (I repeat) come the end of the financial year be that in our case November but others maybe April the end result
is = not a Pot to Pee in. What do PRS/PPL/DCMS etc not understand about that ?? it seems quite simple to grasp.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Our report is NOTHING TO REPORT apart from the fact on average we play 9 songs per-hour. If that changes we will inform PRS/PPL
we shouldn’t have to keep informing them every 12 Months.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Come November our Pockets are empty.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">I didn’t really fill the consultation in for a number of reasons :-</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">1)</span><span class="" style="font-size:7pt"> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">They
already know my/our thoughts on this as I have told them directly on at least 20 occasions since 2008</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">2)</span><span class="" style="font-size:7pt"> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">It
isn’t a consultation really coz the folk at the other end aren’t reading it, nor are they listening</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">3)</span><span class="" style="font-size:7pt"> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
Agenda (if we are being honest with each other) couldn’t really give a flying cactus about us, it was more for making things easier for PRS/PPL not actually a crime, but hey, can we not work together on this please ?</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">4)</span><span class="" style="font-size:7pt"> <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">And
finally --- when Lucy and Laura (who are two lovely people may I add) were in Birmingham, the whole exercise was pointless. Just like all the other nonsenses ie:- BBC man etc etc we sit for an hour being told what the rules are (we already know the
rules)(in fact I know them better than the authorities) they tell more small print, yet again what we already know and then hey presto we get to Bingo time and we’ve run out of time because someone has a Train to catch. This is NOT a consultation, it is
a stitch up. As long as we tip toe and pussyfoot along with it we will for ever be on the receiving end.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">My suggestion is a couple of Grand (£1600 - £2000) for the LOT ……….. this includes the FM and Internet for both and in our case here
at Canalside – if we wish to run a small 100/200 stream training facility for the youngsters that gets chucked in for free. We make no money from this whatsoever but they charge us. We feel so strongly about it that we will possibly be stopping the payments
now as this consultation seems to have achieved not much at all.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Finally, there is NO REPORTING as there is nothing to report. When we have paid all of our bills we end up with not a sausage and then
we start afresh the following year.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">This is all plain sailing and common sense to me ….. trouble is when Community Radio started Common sense went out the window.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Absolutely finally I would like to put my suggestion forward and ask if the CMA and Members will back it. If not, then that’s fine,
but a word of warning ---- you/we are now at a crossroads, get some fire in your bellies (take note) or else Community Radio in the next number of years in the main will start to fade away, and that would be a travesty after all the hard graft we have each
put in.</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Obviously, those just on T’internet would pay about £600 quid-dish ??</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Just done the Maths, and as you know I’m not very good at Maths (nor English LOL) and to my calculation 270 x £2000 = £540,000
unless I have the decimal point in the wrong place (sorry if I have got this wrong) that’s not a bad little guaranteed tickle though for Chrimbo</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Thank you</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">H Dumpty / Doormat FM</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><strong class=""><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></strong><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l-bounces@mailman.<wbr class="">commedia.org.uk</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[<a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.<wbr class="">commedia.org.uk</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><strong class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">On
Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></strong>Ian Hickling<br class="">
<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Sent:</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>01 December 2016 17:17<br class="">
<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">To:</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>The Community Media Association Discussion List <<a href="mailto:cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a><wbr class="">><br class="">
<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Subject:</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [cma-l] PPL & PRS for Music Joint Licence for Community Radio</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">That's Stanford University and US law - no relevance over here fortunately.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif; color:rgb(34,34,34)">Ian Hickling</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><strong class=""><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></strong><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span><span class="" style="font-size:11pt; font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l-bounces@mailman.<wbr class="">commedia.org.uk</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l-bounces@mailman.<wbr class="">commedia.org.uk</a>>
on behalf of Tony Bailey <<a href="mailto:ravensound@pilgrimsound.co.uk" target="_blank" class="">ravensound@pilgrimsound.co.uk</a><wbr class="">><br class="">
<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Sent:</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>01 December 2016 16:39:26<br class="">
<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">To:</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank" class="">cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a><br class="">
<strong class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Subject:</span></strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [cma-l] PPL & PRS for Music Joint Licence for Community Radio</span><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="">
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The term "licence" or "license" is used by an authority but it has also been used to give rights under an agreement:<br class="">
<br class="">
<a href="http://fairuse.stanford.edu/overview/introduction/permission-tools-licenses-and-releases/" target="_blank" class="">http://fairuse.stanford.edu/<wbr class="">overview/introduction/<wbr class="">permission-tools-licenses-and-<wbr class="">releases/</a><br class="">
<br class="">
Tony Bailey<br class="">
<br class="">
On 01/12/16 14:03, Ian Hickling wrote:<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">That's very informative - thank you.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">But they've left out (or - Heaven forbid - ignored) two important aspects of the responses to their Joint Consultation:<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">1 - If this is a Licence - as opposed to a Service Charge - why isn't it issued by the only Licensing Authority in the system - which is Ofcom? PRSfM
and PPL are commercial businesses - not Licensing Authorities<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">2 - Despite many requests - there is still no categorical statement as to why PRSfM and PPL are entitled in Law to claim these payments - and precisely
where this is written in UK Legislation.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Sorry - I know I've asked this many times before - but it's something we do need to have laid before us - and by the very people who are making these
far-reaching demands.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">My feeling is that broadcasters large and small who part with their hard-earned cash before being happy with the answers are rather unwise.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">This isn't going to go away.<br class="">
It makes no odds to us - we don't pay these charges - it's you out there, our friends and loyal Clients, that I'm concerned about.<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> <u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Ian Hickling<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<p class="m_-4072497925101544043ox-3127012898-ecxmsonormal" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:12pt">
<span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Partner<u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></p>
<div class="">
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank" class=""><em class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif; text-decoration:none">Office:
016 3557 8435 (07h to 22h GTS)</span></em></a><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
</div>
<div class="">
<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank" class=""><em class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif; text-decoration:none">Car:
075 3098 0115 (only responds when driving)</span></em></a><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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<div class="" style="margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px"><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank" class=""><em class=""><span class="" style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif; text-decoration:none">6
Horn Street, Compton, NEWBURY, RG20 6QS</span></em></a><u class=""></u><u class=""></u></span></div>
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