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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Alex / Ian and All<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Looks to me like yet another classic
example of the likes of our sector being bullied around by the big whigs and
the heavyweights hmm ? David and Goliath indeed .. and we know what
happened there.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>I’m glad all of this has been
brought up because the fact of the matter is that we are nearly 250 strong and
the correct and proper way of looking at this is that by right if they kick one
everyone should limp. The bully boys are actually taking on the CMA plus
another 250.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>God forbid I hope it never comes to that
as there is no need ……. but sadly, one word that has become
apparent to me over the last fourteen years is ‘’’unreasonable’’’
and it has popped up again in these exchanges.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Somebody/Anybody please enlighten me on
what is ‘’’unreasonable’’’ for charitable /
not-for-profit Community Groups to have a ‘’’reasonable/fair’’’
FIXED FEE payable once a year with nothing to report, as by reporting it doesn’t
make the slightest bit of a difference because it is exactly what it says on
the Can ‘a fixed fee’ and at the end of the year we get a big
zero.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Just take an average, knock a bit off
because it is a one stop shop so include the internet within it and hey presto
everyone is a happy Bunny. Of course some might be a hundred quid adrift
whereas some others might be a hundred quid in pocket …. But that’s
life isn’t it ??<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>For Petes sake, why do we have to make
everything complicated ? I simply don’t get it ?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>I repeat :-<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>One licence covering FM and Internet
which included DAB if we get it (this covers both PRS/PPL)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Hovering around the 2000 mark tops<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Fixed<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>No reporting as the report is nothing to
report and has no bearing because the end result for all 250 Stations come the
end of the Financial Year is not a Pot to pittle in.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>This isn’t rocket science, it is
easy peezy<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Have a good weekend everyone, it’s
a busy one for us out and about in the Community (and the rain) </span></font><font
size=2 color=black face=Wingdings><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Wingdings;color:black'>J</span></font><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> LOL<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Nick H Dumpty / Chairman of the UK
Banging head against a wall society<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk
[mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Two Lochs Radio<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 01 July 2016 11:44<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">The
Community Media Association Discussion List</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [cma-l] Joint PRS/PPL
licences</span></font><span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>It's
embodied in the Copyright Acts Ian. This has all been rehearsed at great length
in past discussions on CMA-L.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>In a
nutshell the law says that in return for the privilege of being a statutorily
recognized 'collecting society' they are obliged to offer suitable and
reasonable licences to anyone who wishes to use the copyright holdings of their
members'.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>The law
also provides for any would-be copyright user who feels an appropriate and fair
licence is not being offered to deem their own licence terms for the time
being, but with the obligation then to make an application to the copyright
tribunal for it to determine what would be fair terms. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>And
that's where the problem lies - the Copyright tribunal is essentially a court
process with the same sorts of potential costs and legal procedures as a
court of law, and in my view this essentially denies justice to small bodies
without the financial resources to risk engaging in the process. PPL also has a
history of deliberately racking up unnecessarily large legal costs at tribunal
(which could fall on the appelant regardless of who wins the underlying case). <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>PPL
relies heavily upon this 'David and Goliath' position to impose burdensome
licences, comforted by the knowledge that none of us (nor would appear the CMA)
has the stomach or financial backing for such a fight.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>The
tribunal decision on which the current tariffs are based was the result of the
last major case brought before the tribunal by the (then) Association of
independent Radio Companies, many years ago and long before not-for-profit
radio was envisaged. It did *not* incidentally include any provision for a
minimum fee to be levied.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>Alex<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite>
<div id=ox-f09d1c624c>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>On 30 June 2016 at 22:21
Ian Hickling <transplanfm@hotmail.com> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>That's surprising - they were
always traditionally at daggers drawn.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>But it still
doesn't answer two points:<br>
1 - Exactly where in Law dies it require broadcasters to
pay these two private organisations a fee that
they determine between them?<br>
2 - If it is a firm legal requirement - why doesn't Ofcom include it
as an integral part of the mandatory licence fee structure?<br>
My feeling is that the answer to the second point determines
the first point.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal style='line-height:17.05pt;background:white'><font
size=4 color="#222222" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:#222222'>Ian Hickling</span></font><font color="#444444"><span
style='color:#444444'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal style='line-height:17.05pt;background:white'><font
size=4 color="#222222" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:#222222'>Partner</span></font><font color="#444444" face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri;color:#444444'><br>
<br>
<a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank" style='cursor:pointer'><font
color="#1155cc"><span style='color:#1155CC;text-decoration:none'><img border=0
width=190 height=60 id="ox-f09d1c624c-ecx_x005f_x0000_i1025"
src="https://ci4.googleusercontent.com/proxy/2SkDsnIzSZgRbNnNKBSiwxiFhFQWRGV55mTjVL23fulnJpstZmYxeKrrYefY4qxiSgkMrAETld64XINLXCsujE_zI5gAsQyWeCWvHixcrNYtar3Sij4YlVBgN2NSQ-n2DsgZvrnpWZlfwCQ=s0-d-e1-ft#http://www.transplanuk.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/transplan_UK_weblogo_190x60.png"
style='border-bottom-style:none;border-left-style:none;border-right-style:none;
border-top-style:none;line-height:22.72px'></span></font></a></span></font><font
color="#444444"><span style='color:#444444'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal style='line-height:17.05pt;background:white'><em><i><font
size=3 color="#222222" face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:#222222'>Office: 016 3557 8435 (07h to 22h GTS)</span></font></i></em><font
color="#444444"><span style='color:#444444'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal style='line-height:17.05pt;background:white'><em><i><font
size=3 color="#222222" face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:#222222'>Car: 075 3098 0115 (only responds when driving)</span></font></i></em><font
color="#444444"><span style='color:#444444'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal style='line-height:17.05pt;background:white'><st1:address
w:st="on"><st1:Street w:st="on"><em><i><font size=3 color="#222222" face=Arial><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#222222'>6 Horn Street</span></font></i></em></st1:Street><em><i><font
color="#222222" face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial;color:#222222'>, <st1:City
w:st="on">Compton</st1:City></span></font></i></em></st1:address><em><i><font
color="#222222" face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial;color:#222222'>, <st1:place
w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">NEWBURY</st1:City>, <st1:PostalCode w:st="on">RG20
6QS</st1:PostalCode></st1:place></span></font></i></em><font color="#444444"><span
style='color:#444444'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center id=ox-f09d1c624c-stopSpelling>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>From: <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">tlr@gairloch.co.uk</st1:PersonName><br>
To: cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk<br>
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2016 11:54:39 +0100<br>
Subject: [cma-l] Joint PRS/PPL licences<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>We received an interesting letter today from PPL
giving notice of termination of our current licence on 31 Dec because they are
proposing to come up with a joint PPL/PRS licence for community radio from that
date.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>This should make things easier for everyone and reduce
the admin burden, which is good news, and I guess will be generally welcomed.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>The letter says PPL and PRS will be consulting with
the sector over the plan - I would urge CMA and anyone else able to respond to
press for the new minimum fee to be no more than the present minimum fee of
either <u>one</u> of the two bodies.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>It seems to me if the new system will reduce their
admin costs, there should be no need for more than the equivalent of one
current minimum fee to cover that, especially as no doubt nowadays more of the
admin is done at low cost by IT than it used to be, rather than an army of
clerks.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=ox-f09d1c624c-ecxmsonormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>Alex<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite>
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