<div dir="ltr">I understand it's all about latency. Apparently the signals travel much slower in fibre (approx 0.7 speed of light I'm told). So if microwave goes close to speed of light, they gain themselves 3ms over 1000km ignoring equipment latency which I guess would be in ns range.<div><br></div><div>All this so they can "cheat" and buy/sell knowing what the price will be in a few milliseconds time. Still, at least it's creating something real (ie: investment in a humongous mast). World's gone mad!</div><div><br></div><div>Glyn</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 22 March 2016 at 12:56, Alex Gray, Two Lochs Radio <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:tlr@gairloch.co.uk" target="_blank">tlr@gairloch.co.uk</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="white" lang="EN-GB" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">With a 100km+ path they would need masts of at least 250m at either side purely to overcome the curvature of the earth.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">They’re using 2.4- 3.7m dishes at 6GHz with an 0.9 degree beamwidth, and at maximum wind they put several tonne-metres of twist on the mast, so it will certainly need to be pretty stable, but I guess they will have calculated all that out. <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">NB the bigger dishes alone weigh in almost half a tonne each, and a max wind load of about 2.5 tonnes each – and they’re putting 4 on one side all above 280 metres – that’s like putting the weight and wind area of several small cars at the top!<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">With a 45dB gain and a beam crossing the channel lengthways towards Ostend (about 110km), they’ll probably manage a several Gbps link, but if they are ‘high frequency traders’ I imagine they are also as interested in getting a link with the shortest and most stable possible latency, more than a huge bandwidth. <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I guess a direct fibre optic would outperform this, but maybe would be far more expensive to lay (including all the legal consents and becoming a telecoms operator etc).<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Alex<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext"> <a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank">cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank">cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Tony Bailey<br><b>Sent:</b> 22 March 2016 12:03<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk" target="_blank">cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [cma-l] Tallest ever Community Radio Mast?<u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div><span class=""><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Yes, Ian,<br><br>Why Richborough? it appears to have a mixed history, with a Roman site and a coal fired power station, now proposed as a green energy site and Grid interconnector to Belgium. I recall the problems with planning permission when the IBA wanted to install the East Kent AM mast and this proposal looks high enough for Long Wave! <br><br>Presumably the height is due to a need to do it in one hop, since repeaters would slow it down and would probably not be faster than fibre cable (the report indicates that data speed is the requirement). It would need to be a guyed mast to avoid wind shifting the beam, are they sure that no-one is installing wind turbines anywhere on the route? It will also need aircraft warning lights so will be very visible at night.<br><br>Tony Bailey<br><br>On 22/03/16 09:17, Ian Hickling wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div></span><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><span class=""><p class="MsoNormal">I think a seasonal pinch of salt might be wise. <u></u><u></u></p></span><div><span class=""><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">I wonder if they have any idea how much these things cost - and how they can be used in a real-life situation?<br>I would have thought we have adequate ways of sending material across the Channel very cheaply already.<u></u><u></u></p><div><p>Ian Hickling<u></u><u></u></p></div><p style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Partner<span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p></span><div><p><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><i><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none">Office: 016 3557 8435 (07h to 22h GTS)</span></i></a><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p></div><div><div class="h5"><div><p><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><i><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none">Car: 075 3098 0115 (only responds when driving)</span></i></a><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p></div><div><p><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><i><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none">6 Horn Street, Compton, NEWBURY, RG20 6QS</span></i></a><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></a></p><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><hr size="3" width="100%" align="center"></span></a></span></span></div><p class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none">Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2016 18:55:31 +0000<br>From: <u><span style="color:blue">info@a-bc.co.uk</span></u><br>To: <u><span style="color:blue">cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk</span></u><br>Subject: [cma-l] Tallest ever Community Radio Mast?</span></a><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none">Interesting story from Alwyn on the MB21 discussion forum - don't think it's first of April yet...: </span></a><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none">http//<u><span style="color:blue">planning.dover.gov.uk</span></u><br><br>Application reference 16/00044<br><br>An application for a 320m high 3m face width mast at Richborough, which it is proposed will host free of charge a community radio station for East Kent.<br><br>The reason for such largesse? The mast will form part of a shortened microwave path to mainland Europe for high frequency trading.<br><br>Believe it or not, a second application is on the way from a competitor in this business for a 305m high mast, also at Richborough, also offering free hosting of community radio:<br><br><u><span style="color:blue">http://www.kefmast.co.uk</span></u><br><br><u><span style="color:blue">http://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/mar/01/high-frequency-traders-turn-rural-kent-into-telecoms-battleground</span></u></span></a><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none">What a shame there's "no frequencies available". </span></a><span><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><u></u><u></u></span></span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.transplanuk.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:black;text-decoration:none"><br>_______________________________________________ Reply - 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