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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I’m just wondering whether I am
getting correspondence through on an adhoc basis ? …. I appear to missing
some of the trail … or at least it seems that way. Is someone saying that
this ‘’civil disobedience discussion was ‘broadcast’
??? certainly not by us and as I have already explained on a
number of occasions it has once again all been taken out of context.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Firstly, before anyone comes diving in ‘’No
! I am not backtracking nor U-Turning !’’ I am
merely saying that some folk appear to have read it wrong.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>For clarification :- What I am trying to
point out is this ………..we have gone uphill and down dale about
26 times now over the past 8 – 10 years …. We all know the
arguments for and against and in my opinion (yes my opinion) our arguments have
been extremely valid, the counter argument extremely weak which focuses on ‘protecting’
commercialism for the sake of protecting it ???? or that’s how I
see it. There is one more counter argument when we try to counter that (if that
makes sense) and that is that the restrictions HAVE WORKED in
protecting the commercial Stations as none have fallen over. ONCE AGAIN as
usual everyone seems to have completely missed the point. The point ought to be
that what we do is LIFT the restrictions and then see what the result is. I don’t
believe it will make any difference to the commercial Stations but it will help
us to grab that tiny little bit extra which allows us to do a lot more and cuts
out a ruck of bureaucratic nonsense.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>We have run with the ‘argument’
against for 10 years … let’s try the other and if ( yes if ) there
are a few problems (genuine problems) then we peg it back a bit and
re-introduce something (a mini restriction for example)
because at least then we will ALL know the facts, both us and the commercials. For
the last ten years we have been operating on a myth. We have only looked at
this from one end of the drainpipe..<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>So back to the point ……….
The point being re:- my civil disobedience statement
(which clearly came out all wrong and possibly wasn’t the description I
was looking for) is, I am saying we have gone through
all the arguments and there has been a small move … the reason it is SMALL
is because it has taken ten years to get it ……….SO
we have a choice, carry on waffling about it, or do something with a bit more
clout. I don’t mind either way, I will run with the majority. I am just
trying to create debate and discussion and more importantly stand up for our
sector.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Please read back through the e-mail trails
for perfectly logical explanations and reasons why certain things are said and
don’t read to directly into them.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thank you all<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>By the way ….. who has broadcast
this
??? certainly not I ??<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>One final thing in all of this that
everyone seems to forget (even Ed et al) and it is the MOST IMPORTANT factor of
all ……………………. If the
general public prefer to [[ listen to a load of rookies getting in a pickle
on-air, school kids reading poems, wealth and hell being discussions about why hippopotamus
toe nail sandwiches are good for you, Doctor Smith doing an hour long talk
programme on how to care for your haemorrhoids (Johnny Giles) …. the local
WI on how to bake the perfect cup cake etc etc ]]
--- than listen to spoon fed pop, presenters
who all sound the same and what the latest lingerie range is from Victoria Beckham,
then one can plonk as many restrictions on as they wish, they all mean nothing,
because if your listenership has gone Bon Voyage as a commercial Station, the
cause is lost anyway.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I would like it putting on record again
that I do not want any commercial Station to fall over and that includes silk
just down the road from us, I worked there for 9 years and had many a happy
hour, but likewise I do not want to see any of our guys going belly up either ……..sadly,
in this statement there are commercials who have wanted to see the back of us,
and that is a fact. They are the ones who have created the
ill-feeling not us !<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The whole thing is a nonsense <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Nick<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk
[mailto:cma-l-bounces@mailman.commedia.org.uk] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Ian Hickling<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 31 January 2015 14:28<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> The Community Media
Association Discussion List<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [cma-l] Climate Radio
programmes</span></font><span lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'>Quote:<br>
".........</span></font><font size=3 color="#444444" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#444444;background:white'>the
campaign to kick corporate influence out of our democracy and the need for
civil disobedience......"</span></font><font face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri'><br>
Sheer lunacy to attempt to broadcast that sort of thing!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Calibri'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center id=stopSpelling>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'>Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2015 23:40:19 +0000<br>
From: eddie@kcr.fm<br>
To: cma-l@mailman.commedia.org.uk<br>
Subject: Re: [cma-l] Climate Radio programmes available!<br>
<br>
I haven't discussed this yet with anyone else at the station, so this is purely
my personal opinion.<br>
<br>
My initial concern when the original email came out were the words (amongst
others):-<br>
> the campaign to kick corporate<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> influence out of our
democracy <b><i><u><span style='font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>and the
need for civil<o:p></o:p></span></u></i></b></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><i><u><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:Calibri;font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>
disobedience;</span></font></u></i></b><font face=Calibri><span
style='font-family:Calibri'><br>
<br>
However balanced the programme(s) may or may not be, I personally would not
want to go near anything that looked at the need for civil disobedience.<br>
<br>
Yes, women would probably have had to wait far longer to get the vote etc
without the sufragettes, but given the "joys" that we had in Scotland
last year with excesses & sheer nastiness between the "Yes" &
"No" referendum camps, trolls being investigated by the police,
people being threatened verbally & apparently physically etc., etc., I just
would not want to get involved with a "debate" like that.<br>
<br>
One hot head and you're in trouble (remember, the NofTW decided to name and
shame (supposed) paedophiles. A drunk bunch in <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Plymouth</st1:place></st1:City> (I think??) became a lynch mob which
went to try and literally string up a (female) paediatrician.<br>
<br>
Yes, you could (should!) balance it with the down sides of civil disobedience
but you only need one paper to (mis)report (part of) your broadcast and away
you go (How many people actually heard Ross/Brand & Andrew Sachs? Very few.
How many complained? Tens of thousands.)<br>
<br>
If you interview Greenpeace, FoE etc., you must include, or at least give the
right of reply to, Shell, BP etc even if you personally think that they are the
devil incarnate. Without actually fighting their corner for them, they might
just want to point out that they are also working on renewables and that
without fossil fuels the Industrial Revolution wouldn't have happened and we
would still have a peasant farming economy based on horse & cart.......??
Indeed, we might not have Community Radio??!!<br>
<br>
I think that a Community Station getting involved with the way that that email
read is just asking for trouble. We have tackled some fairly contentious issues
up here but have always been extremely careful on balance.....<br>
<br>
Light blue touch paper...........? Not me on this one given what we know so
far.<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Eddie Stuart<br>
<br>
<br>
On 30/01/15 19:05, David Duffy wrote:<br>
> Nick, as you know, I respect<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> your enthusiasm but /all/
broadcasters,<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > not just community
radio, are required to adhere to the<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > Communications Act
2003 and The Representation of the People<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> Act.<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > These are enshrined in
statute for our benefit and to ensure<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> that<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > broadcasters exercise
due impartiality. Otherwise, we could<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> have<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > stations that support
one political party over another using<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> that as<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > a means to promote a
highly partisan message. I give you Fox<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> News'<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > ‘Fair and
Balanced’. Anyone who has watched Fox News<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> understands the<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > irony in that
positioning statement.<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > All I would recommend
to community broadcasters is that they<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> revisit<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > Section 6 of the
Broadcasting Code<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> ><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'><a
href="http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/broadcast/831190/section6.pdf"
target="_blank"><http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/broadcast/831190/section6.pdf></a><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > and in particular 6.12
where the onus is clearly on the<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> broadcaster -<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > '/Where a candidate is
taking part in a programme on any<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> matter,<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > after the election has
been called, s/he must not be given<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> the<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > opportunity to make
constituency points, or electoral area<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> points<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > about the constituency
or electoral area in which s/he is<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> standing,<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > when no other
candidates will be given a similar<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> opportunity/.’<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > It has been mentioned
previously that Ofcom is a reactive<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> rather than<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > proactive
disciplinarian. If there is one time during your<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> 5-year<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > licence that an
unhappy listener is likely to complain to<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> Ofcom it’s<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > during the run up to
an election. People get very worked up<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> over<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > this kind of stuff!<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > David<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > /David Duffy is a
Senior Partner with //- providing<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> professional<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > consultancy and
services to commercial and community<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> broadcasters<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > worldwide./<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > M: 07817 990760 T:
@theradiopeople<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <a
href="http://www.twitter.com/theradiopeople" target="_blank"><http://www.twitter.com/theradiopeople></a>
F:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > facebook.com/theradiopeople<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <a
href="https://www.facebook.com/theradiopeopleuk" target="_blank"><https://www.facebook.com/theradiopeopleuk></a>
L:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> >
linkedin.com/in/davidgduffy<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> <a
href="http://uk.linkedin.com/in/davidgduffy/" target="_blank"><http://uk.linkedin.com/in/davidgduffy/></a>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > W:
theradiopeople.co.uk<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> <a
href="http://www.theradiopeople.co.uk/" target="_blank"><http://www.theradiopeople.co.uk/></a><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Calibri><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Calibri'> > <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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